Monday, May 23, 2022

Denilson’s Arsenal departure slower than Denilson

Denilson (pictured above in yellow, but without a head) could remain an Arsenal player until June 2013, although he won’t be playing at the Emirates anytime soon.

According to Samba Football, the crab-tastic Brazilian looks set for a 12-month extension to his current loan spell with Sao Paulo after the club’s hierarchy announced they were eager to retain his services following an upturn in form.

“Our conversation was that we have every interest in continuing as we are,” said João Paulo de Jesus Lopes, vice-president of São Paulo. “We want to renew at the end of the contract and he has said he wants too.

“He [Denilson] will speak with his representatives who will contact the English club. There is no rush because he is here until the middle of the year.”

Pretty much frozen out by Arsene Wenger last season following the rise of Jack Wilshere and return of Aaron Ramsey, the 24-year-old returned to his childhood club during the summer casting major doubts on his long-term future at the Emirates.

While few fans will shed a tear about Denilson’s continued absence, the fact that Ivan Gazidis seems unable to negotiate a transfer fee for the midfielder demonstrates the danger of handing young and average squad members big-money, long-term deals.

It remains to be seen whether the likes of Nicklas Bendtner and Carlos Vela continue to be loaned or if a similar situation pans out for them as well.

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Must be willing to almost give Vela, Squillaci, Denilson and Bendtner away on nominal fees just to get them off the wage bill.


At least Almunia’s contract is up in June.


So is Squillaci’s.


I think Squillaci’s contract until summer 2013. According to this article we signed him in August 2010 on a 3 year contract.

American gooner

That’s only half the story my friend, to give them away you must have the players’ consent to…be given away. They have all the power in these long term contracts. I think Arsene and Ivan feel the only reasonable thing is to loan them out and hope that the wages are at least shared with us.
You could bash Arsene all you want but I supposed his hands were tied as well in the last few years.


Crap who do you think chose how much these kids get paid?


@Stonroy – you’re absolutely right that its the responsibility of the club management. But on the other hand, us fans are also quick to castigate lé boss and the board when a player we would like to keep walks away on a free because they *didn’t* tie that player down to a long term contract. Flamini is a case in point – he only showed his true ability and form for us in the last year of his contract. Perhaps we could have tied him down to a longer term contract earlier on in his time with us but at… Read more »


Stonroy, you cannot be serious. Real life is not the same as your Football Manager or Championship Manager game: managers DO NOT sit across the table and negotiate player contracts, let alone design the wage structure.


i don’t really care as long as denilson is away.i see this season as a foundation for years to come.personally i want loose ends tied up this summer and start next one afresh.
as simple as this.
out:vela,nb52,almunia,denilson,squillachi,mannone,chamakh and other loan failures.
in:ryo,campbell,afobe and maybe lansbury

park is a mystery.personally i hope he stays and plays in cup matches.


giving bendter away would be stupid, just let him play the euros, score 3 goals, and then we can sell him to a midtable bundesliga club for 4-5 mil


Soundest advice yet


Did I hear on here recently about Arsenal having a shake up of their wage system in the summer? Definitely needs to happen. Obviously Arsenal do everything they can to be a sustainable club and being able to dispose of mediocrity in order to free up money to increase wages of our more pivotal players would definitely help us in this respect. It would also help in terms of keeping players like Song and Van Persie at the club.

the only sam is nelson

if you had your way, song would have been sold 3 or 4 seasons ago after a so-so loan spell @ Charlton and RvP would have been sold off for glue

it’s precisely these kind of contracts that allow Arsenal to develop talent, something that takes years and not weeks.

sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. but without decent long-term contracts our club will bleed vital future talent to lesser clubs, which we’ll then have to buy back at wildly inflated prices.


I’m not against long term contracts, just not an entire squad on above average wages having not shown enough to justify them.


Good point and I trust Wenger and Gazidis know what they’re doing far more than me. Obviously it would have been wrong to lose those players but there are other ways of keeping young players. Keeping on top of contract situations so that someone who is proving they are becoming an asset to the team gets a gradual improvement. Players should be rewarded on proven on the pitch effectiveness rather than potential. Contracts for a big club like Arsenal and the wage it brings should be a motivation for players to improve. Surely long term contracts for young players breeds… Read more »

the only sam is nelson

so the obvious solution to this problem would have been to offer alex song a £5K a week contract at 21, so he’d have gone off to another club for £25K a week and now a wealthier club like Man Citeh would buy him for £20m+ and put him on a £150k a week contract? Or perhaps you take a gamble that he’ll come good and offer him the chance to make a good living doing what he loves at a top club. some players will respect that and respond to it – song seems as good an anyone of… Read more »


Yes, but a contract does not have to consist of a never changing flat rate and can be updated. And if Man City want to offer a player a stupid amount of money they can still do that if we’re paying them generously, they can double what we pay our players. If a player wants to go for money and they’re wanted then a club like Man City can offer them that and we can’t match it. But the fact is our players stay with us for other reasons than money.


Denilson looked a really talented prospect at one point. It’s always a gamble, just goes to show how important a players mentality is for their development. Messi is a better footballer than Maradona ever was for that reason.


I guess a lot of it comes down to the individual. Cesc left to go home, a fat salary wouldn’t have kept him. Nasri on the other hand…

I think the moral of this debate is that Nasri is a cunt.


Yeah for sure. For every Song there’ll be 10 Bendtner’s. It’s strange, people criticising Arsenal’s acquisition policies, we’ve done pretty well in the transfer market since Arsene, we’ve run our business pretty darn well compared to basically every other club everywhere, and people still complain. If bad things happen within this policy of ours, then its because it’s the least worst system. Every policy has it’s downsides, please judge our policy by success on the pitch and in the bank balance.


This is actually useful and pertinent discussion, thanks for that Sam & George! I do agree with Sam’s arguments, still I think a club like Citeh can always outbid Arsenal in terms of money. So yes, we need to offer players incentives other than only money. This includes: playing time, facilities, family and surroundings, German sausages etc etc. You “can” attract good players in “inferior” positions you just need to make a smart offer. Look at Dortmund, they bought Hummels from Bayern (a direct and better competitor) for a mere 5M, offering him playing time, a good long term perspective,… Read more »


Performance related pay, Sam?

Do you think all promising youngsters elsewhere get 4/5 deals on £50k p/w for showing a bit of potential? Or if they don’t do you think they all get signed by City on bazillions p/w?

I know you’re trying to make a point with the extremes, but there’s no need to be a tit 🙂

Danish Bergkamp

Now, I most certaintly am way out of my debth here but wouldn’t it be possible to design special contract for prospects, say 10K a week plus a perfomance bonus of 40K a week contingent on being in the first team squad (or something equally devious). If the player doesn’t come through or the performance drops considerably so will the wage and they should then be easier to move on, and more willing to.

Of course, if the another club offers better conditions the player will move before we even know the full extend of his crapness.


Sorry DB – didn’t get to yours before posting on PRP. I would hope there’s something to explore there, if perhaps not to 10/40 but a slightly higher salary (to be competitive as Sam suggests).


just want to drop a comment to say great debate lads, always nice to see people putting intelligent ideas forward and sharing them with fellow gooners, it’s refreshing and hardly ever exist on internet forums due to nasriesque trolls

NA$RIS A CUNT (put that in so people will like my comment, but its also very true)


Vela is likely to be bought by sociedad. Bendtner’s contract is up, so is almunia’s. Hopefully the squid’s contract is also running out, but i think he had a 3 year deal.


According to this article Bendtner has a contract until 2014 (he signed a 5 year deal in 2009).


I scrolled down to read the comments posted and one bloke had written “A player (Bendtner) with more self confidence than Messi and lesser talent than Denilson”….Hilarious..double whammy…


Bendtner signed a long term contract in 2009, he’s here or on loan until 30.06.2014. He’s not done too bad at Sunderland this year, he should sell.


Someone will have to pay the 50k per week (or whatever ridiculous wage he is on) per week first.


According to Vela, he doesn’t like London and doesn’t feel he has a place at Arsenal either (as opposed to Arshavin who despite what newspaper readers accuse, has apparently left his family here for the duration of his loan period and fully intends to get his form back enough for him to return), so I think him being sold on is effectively a done deal at this point. As for Bendtner – well he’s a whinger. But he’s about forty times better than Chamakh. And hell, I’m still entertained in a weird way by his douchebaggery. I would have had… Read more »


b52 has 3 goals in 4 games now and with a good euro-cup (I know it’s pretty unlikely with the Danish chances in that group) we can actually get some decent money


As for Bendtner – well he’s a whinger. But he’s about forty times better than Chamakh. === Well, Bendtner has a habit of getting better and better in our minds the further he is from the club (remember when he was at Birmingham in 06-07, and we were desperately hoping he could end his loan spell early to rescue our season?). But definitely, I agree he’s better than Chamakh. Actually, I’m not sure who’s worse than Chamakh, so maybe that’s not saying much. I’d take an injured Peter Lovenkrands right now over Chamakh. I’d take Emile…. No, hold on a… Read more »

Wes Mantooth

Selling Bendtner would be Like A Double Sale (LADS). The club would be selling him and his ego.

the only sam is nelson

incredible that people moan about big money contracts for no-hopers

the same people who went mad with rage when Szceszny was handed a £30K a week deal before he’d played 1 minute of premier league football, probably


Szczensy (like Wilshere, like Chamberlain) was obviously destined for greatness. It’s the punts that are more objectionable

the only sam is nelson

if you can tell that you’d be worth £200K a year to arsenal, minimum. plus commissions as well no doubt. you should get in touch.



Do me a favour.

I know numerous people and remember a few posters who couldn’t understand Wengers logic in giving Szczesny a long term contract when his only game time had been a season-long loan at Brentford. It just goes to show the difference in knowledge between the manager/coaches working with a player everyday and the ‘FIFA/Football Manager’ generation only watching them for maximum of 120 minutes once a week (maybe twice depending on cups). RvP, Song and Rosicky are players from the current squad that people have wanted to be sold over the years. Koscielny, Chamberlain, Arteta and Mertesacker are all players many… Read more »


Fickle fans are fickle.


120 mins twice a week, you say? I’ll have some of what you’re drinking, CRF! Plus the whole FM lines are worth dropping, finally.. You can’t pluck out a few names that a few people may have given up on, for various reasons (which at the time may have seemed valid), then accuse people of being part of the FM generation if they happen to have previously expressed an opinion on one or more of those players. FFS we could get into strife with goal-keeper injuries again & Almunia might spring into life only to dominate the position for a… Read more »


The comments are getting ridiculous. If the club give out rewarding long term contracts and can’t move the players on, people moan. If the club give out not so rewarding short contract and lose players to free transfer, people still moan. Seriously? Its call risk and reward. As long as there’s money involve this is pretty much a universal business rule. Yes, the club has got some decisions wrong but more or less these decisions are not fatal. What about the good decisions? In the end there’s no knowing without hindsight. If anyone can predict how much a player is… Read more »


A mate’s a Brentford supporter and to him, that was a “no brainer”. He said at the time that SZCZ was the best they’d ever had and the icing on the cake was that he was only on a 2 grand a week youth wage. Without that improved deal someone would have snapped him up, probably Brentford.

You’ve got a young player out on loan, being payed peanuts and the loan club reports he’s the best thing since sliced bread. What would you do?


Incredible that you defend each and every club decision – no employee at AFC can possibly do any wrong. Judgment was off when these contracts were handed out, it was a wrongheaded policy that backfired. It doesn’t make you less of a fan to acknowledge that.


I don’t think it was a wrongheaded policy that backfired though. If you look at our success with it and weight that against the inevitable occasional failure then you’ll see that the policy has actually worked quite well for us. Yes, it’s going to go wrong sometimes; all systems have their downsides, but ours has worked, hasn’t it? We’re doing pretty well in the league, we’re balancing our books like no other club anywhere, we’re playing a great style of football, we’re going to strengthen the squad and loose some of the dead wood….what’s your problem?


gladys, the problem is Arsenal are stuck on repeat, the policy will remain going forward, and it’s gotten old for some of us. Not for you clearly though, so we can agree to disagree.

Cygan's Right Foot

Who’s policy would you prefer? City’s? They spent more in 2 seasons than we have in our history and are out of everything bar the league and now they trail utd. Our policy is working well, has kept us competitive and also allowed us to clear debt very quickly.


Who are you talking to? Troll on Sammy.


Its a real challenge for any manager. When you have so many young players who you develop you dont want to lose them for pittance. But on the other hand you enver know how many of them will turn up to be worth their wages. We tied down Cesc, Denilson, Bendtner, Vela , Wilshere and Ramsey with long term contracts.. Only Cesc was worth it. Hopefully Aaorn and Jack can live up to the expectations.


lol, only cesc was worth it.

Please, I can’t take it anymore.


So wilshire wasnt worth it?



The guy said “Hopefully Aaorn and Jack can live up to the expectations”. Give him a break, a totally reasonable comment with regards to those two after a first season back for one and a whole season out for the other.


So Wilshere is world class based on 1 season? How convenient. :Love the guy. Hate the fact that idiots like you expect miracles from him.


There is this thing with 22 men on a pitch kicking a ball for 90 minutes, it is called football, I suggest you take your head out of your arse and watch it sometime


I am Brazilian and I can say to you: Denilson is the same as always harmless, playing in Sao Paulo. To make matters worse, he acquired the habit of being expelled. Just last year were four expulsions.
He will not make any difference at Arsenal, I think Eastmond may have more chances next season, instead of using Denilson again.


Poor, poor, Arsene in bad situations like these. They choose to run down their contract because Arsene often throws big money at them even though they are average at best.

Djourou, another average is now under a new 4 year 50k contract. Diaby, who never plays has had his contract extended up to 2016 for 60k a week.

No wonder, Almunia has chosen to run down his contract rather than leave because no club will take him for his average performance for 50k a week.


No wonder Robin van Persie is a phenomenal player for now, it’s because Wenger kept him and actually knows more about his playing than your average Arsenal fan! Joy!

Gutbukkit Deffrolla

People who complain that Diaby ‘never’ plays always seem to overlook the fact that he played 40 times two seasons ago and 20 times last season. You have to take a longer view of things, as Arsene Wenger did with RVP. Diaby is a very good player, and will be great for us once he gets back to fitness. Wenger clearly believes he will do so, and so is happy to extend his contract. I’m happy to wait and see.

Fed up of Barca


Offer them Denislon for 8m, but throw in Vela and Bendtner for free.

Buy 1 get 2 free.


Summer sale.


Wenger and Gazidis has stated that all loaning clubs pay the player wages.

Gutbukkit Deffrolla

This is good to hear. Perhaps Arsenal aren’t run by idiots after all ? And with the loaned players not being included in the squad when they are on a season loan then most of the desperate cries of “Get them off of our payroll”, “Make a space in our squad”, and “They must be sold NOW” are pointless. Who cares if Bendtner is technically our player if he is not in the squad and isn’t costing us anything? Never wants to play for us again? Who gives a shit? Same for Denilson – Sao Paulo want him another year… Read more »


Besides, these players were brought in for very little money.


Imagine how loud the moaning would be if Flamini had signed a long-term and then become the bust he has become. Denilson had far more good matches for Arsenal than Flamini.

Rocket science is easy compared to predicting who will become great.


Don’t know what Flamini’s become, but he sure was brilliant back then.

But we’ve still got Song.


Where is flamini now?


Flamini is at AC Milan. He has been mainly injured, or in the bench.


Fans were moaning when Wenger let 3 DMs go in six months – Diarra, Flamini and Gilberto – and not replaced as Wenger wanted to play Denilson and Diaby. The fans on this occasion were right. This is not hindsight, we feared we’d decline the next season and so we did.

Clock End Mike

That _is_ hindsight. “The fans on this occasion were right” — even by chance it might happen occasionally. More often than not, the doomsayers are wrong. Only with hindsight can you say whether they were right or wrong.

Sorry, but I believe only Gilberto, of those three, I would have wished to see stay. Flamini had half a great season. So did Na$ri. Diarra? Was good for a month or two after he left. Where is he now?

Gutbukkit Deffrolla

The decline of Arsenal after those sales was from 3rd to 4th place finish in the PL the season after they left, and then a return to 3rd the following season. In the FA Cup we got much further in 2008-9 than we did in 2007-8. That isn’t much of a decline. Hell, when I read your post I thought I must have missed us being relegated or something!!!! Then I realised that you hadn’t ended your post with FACT!!!! If you are going to use examples to prove that the fans were right and Arsene Wenger was wrong… pick… Read more »


Brilliant title


Vela’s actually doing quite well at Sociedad.


Was the picture meant to reflect a ‘headless chicken’? If so, well played.


If Denilson ran half as fast as a headless chicken, we might not have such a pain to offload him 😉


As long as the clubs they are loaned to are paying thier full wages, I don’t have a problem with it. They are clearly not setting the world alight at the clubs they are at otherwise a transfer fee would be no problem. Some of these players obviously have little value in that case.
As long as the likes of denilson and bentner stay away from our first team I’m happy.


Could someone please explain to me what incentive Sao Paulo would have in negotiating a transfer fee with Arsenal? Sure the player may improve so much that he’d be wanted by other clubs but especially given that he is home, the risk is probably quite low. So why not wait until his contract runs out before signing him?

I might be totally off base with this so if I am, someone please enlighten me.




Sorry mate but I think the club just want to extend his loan rather than pay a transfer. His contract will be up in a year or so and then they will get him for sweet fa.
They have us over a barrel really, as he’s a player we don’t want back but cannot get a fee for and we also don’t want to pay his crazy wages either.


I don’t know if you guys have done the maths yet, but Arsenal have made a ton of money in the transfer market (or overall profit, or really any way you measure it) despite the fact that the club signed a few people on more money than they probably should have. In other words: you have to sign a few Denilsons if you want to make a killing off an Adebayor. All of which simply proves that Arsene gets some things spectacularly right, some things spectacularly wrong, and almost everything else just plain right. Sorry about injecting that, I now… Read more »


@Tim – how do you figure that out? Clearly the frustration is that lots of players on seemingly bloated wages soak up our cash day to day, not that we don’t get a monster fee for each one. Plus, take out property & potentially misleading half-year results, and we don’t actually make that much cash from the footy business.. Never mind taking sponsorship etc. out – I know even for you it would be tough to answer, but I’d be intrigued to know whether it is actually profitable giving big contracts to many & cashing out on few. Of course… Read more »

It is what it is

A long contract wards off other clubs looking at the availability of players. A distant contract end date, means you would have to pay a substantially greater amount to compensate outlay by parent/owning club e.g. signing on fees. I don’t believe the amount we pay these players are solely down to AW. Agents & financial directors have a hand in these negotiations. And in some cases, the selling club could have a say too. As far as prospects are concerned, Denilson was coveted by many and SEEMED of good stock. He had captained the Brazil youth teams at various age… Read more »


wenger should bring back Denilson he is a player i look up all the time he will be good again just watch out for him

the optimist in me says


Gutbukkit Deffrolla

He has São Paulo (and Brazilian) DNA so he was always destined to return to his home club (like Fabregas. It was destiny). He wants to be there. We want him to be there. It would be cruel to force him to return to us or sell him to some horrible club where he might not be happy.

bob's your uncle

Favourite headline so far!

Can’t wait to see the back of that guy..for me he summed up our lost generation.
Over paid, over comfortable, and over rated.
We’ve got some gems at our club now,and as sad as I was to see cesc go, I would never swap that side for this.

Fuck off Denison and take all those games of everyone watching the ref get back before you did, with you.

And vela can fuck off too.


are you insane?

fuck arteta, hes not good enough for rangers let alone us.,

Cesc would piss over all these b rate players.

fuck third loser bullshit.


Madonna? Are you sure it shouldn’t say Maradona?

‘Cause you’re sure not making any sense…

bob's your uncle

Yes I would rather have a team instead of one player. ..madonna..
Good luck with your evaluation of players.. Have a look at arteta’s stats for this season.
And we didn’t actually win much with cesc as captain.

Maybe you should go watch cesc win things at barca.. Madonna.


@maddona cesc was good when he was it’s a closed clearly don’t know can you compare arteta and sure we’ll have someone playing out and out creative role next season.wenger is no fool.this season the creative burden had to be shared by many players and they have done a wonderful job.players like song,rosicky,ramsey did a wonderful job.also having a certain van persie makes their job much of the strongest points this season is our wing sure next season with jack,diaby back and maybe with new signings we’ll be attacking through the middle as well… Read more »


Jeykyll, firstly i suspect you are not an Arsenal supporter. The handle gives a hint, but having read & re read all of your posts on this thread, frankly you are taking utter shite!!! Best illustrated by The guy said “Hopefully Aaorn and Jack can live up to the expectations”. Give him a break, a totally reasonable comment with regards to those two after a first season back for one and a whole season out for the other. I find that post staggering in it’s pure ignorance, disrespect & disregard for the facts. And are you really suggesting that following… Read more »


Perhaps you could not read things into my comments that are not there before you start throwing around the insults. I stand by my critique of overpaying mediocre and youth players. I nowhere dismiss the entire policy of signing and developing young players – that would be as stupid as you thinking that I did. On Jack, I simply said ‘hopefully they live up to expectations’ is fair comment. I loved Jack last season, I hope he goes on to be a great player for us. My comment was nothing to do with whatever contract he’s on. Think before you… Read more »


Why do people keep saying:

“You lot wanted RVP out in the past”.

Please, give it a rest – fucking playground conversation really is dull.

bob's your uncle

You seem to have had a stressful day mate..
Ease of the angry pills

H.P. Arsecraft

Nothing is slower than Denilson! Not even Denilson leaving!


i think people are being very harsh on both denilson and bendtner, both of whom were decent prospects for us and had periods where they looked like they were going to be very good players. i still think bendtner can be a top player if someone can get his head right and denilson is probably worth 40-50k a week in the current market. don’t forget what a good season he had for us after flamini left. it’s not arsene’s fault that bosman happened and that wages have gone crazy. i’m tired of hearing all the whining armchair managers thinking they… Read more »


I have to admit I still quite like Bendtner, his attitude might stink at times but the guy has potential to score. I would take him back as a back-up rather than spending silly money on a player who’s going to sit on the bench anyway.

I can see your point, since Arsenal is consider a big club even mediocre players’ wage gets elevated. To put it in another way, Arsenal is paying the going rate.


I know this is not necessarily related to Arsenal or Denilson, but if you were worried about our own Stan Kroenke buying another sports franchise, no worries…although I don’t think the boss of all bosses would have been bothered, he seems to do just fine with the insane amount of companies he owns now.,0,5012740.story Magic Johnson’s group won the bid to own the Los Angeles Dodgers baseball team and Stan will be left to look for something else to buy worth possible billions. Just thought I would drop this in a spot that was getting a high volume of… Read more »

[…] a one by one basis, we all know who they are, we know who the ones on loan are (and it looks as if Denilson will spend another season on loan in Brazil), and in an ideal world who we’d let go this […]


Link for the current state of Arsenal Player contracts


We can all agree that Denilson is a pube that either needs to be gently combed out or cut the fuck of.

Conor Campbell

denilsons play on average is both productive and efficient. only the productive part isnt efficient and the efficient part isnt productive.


To be fair in comparison with other top level clubs, arsenal’s wage structure isn’t that bad, yes there’s a few players earning more than the deserve, but that’s just the gambles that didn’t pay off, Bendtner, denilson, Diaby, all prob on 50k, we’re not talking 90k (thats how much Jovanovic was earning at Liverpool lol), the real underlying prob, has been poor poor business on the commercial side of things, which has forced, Arsenal to offer contracts to players based on potential and take a gamble, as splashing 20 + mill on a player isn’t a luxury they can afford,… Read more »


we have arteta now so there is no need for Denilson


We can always hold out for hope that Tottenham will pick him up!


If he likes it so much let him and then sell. I think we are in the zone, if AW can get that 3 or 4 players in and introduce 3 to 4 smart reserves we have its big time from here. I think that general thought going around on the likes of B52,AA,Chamakh,Vela,Denilson,Squillaci is that they have been around long enough on a big fat pay packet and wont improve even if they were given another 10 seasons Most these bloke are injury free and not shaping up no matter where they are. I know the exception to the… Read more »


I remember when Denilson actually began to come good for us in 09/10. Scoring some fantastic goals like the scorcher v Everton and the lovely free kick against Hull City.

He really could have been a very good player for us if he only had a better mindset.

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