Friday, March 29, 2024

Odegaard and Arteta on VAR and Martinelli’s ‘goal’

Gabriel Martinelli’s fantastic strike ought to have made it 1-0 to Arsenal in the 12th minute of today’s 3-1 defeat to Man Utd at Old Trafford.

Instead, VAR does what VAR does, and it chalked off the goal for a foul in the build-up by Martin Odegaard on Christian Eriksen. It was generous, to say the least, but then this has been a weekend when officiating has flummoxed and frustrated football fans, and it did the same to the Arsenal captain and manager.

Speaking to Sky Sports, Martin Odegaard said, :”In my opinion, it’s never a foul. The referee sees it and plays play on.

“It’s a soft challenge and for VAR to come in it has to be clear and obvious. That’s been said a lot of times.

“On the camera, you can always make it look a little bit worse, but, for me, that was never a foul so it’s frustrating.

“I barely touched him, they keep saying this is the Premier League and want it to be physical. I don’t understand how he can go back on it.”

While Mikel Arteta was unhappy about how a foul one day can not be a foul the next, or even from one game to another.

“It’s inconsistency,” he said. “What is soft? Last week, we had a foul on Aaron (Ramsdale) that was soft, but wasn’t given, and foul on Bukayo (Saka) that was soft, but it’s not a penalty. Then today another soft challenge and it’s a foul.

“From the first action there were some strong tackles, but no yellow card because they want to put the threshold up because it’s a big game, so really difficult to understand.”

On the result, Odegaard continued, ““Yeah, of course, we have to look to the next one, we’re still on top of the league.

“We have to look for the next one, win that one, that’s all. There were a lot of good moments in the game as well, so we have to take those and learn from the bad ones as well.

“Then look for the next game.”

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Bendtnerschristmastree

No need to panic. We dominated them, but they always grind out results against us at OT (with a little help from local refs ofc). Too bad MA was so trigger happy with the subs there, but we move on.
Will be nice seeing Eddie and Fabio linking up on thursday.

Living stone

Completely baffles my imagination how the refree,having witnessed the tackle ‘first-hand’,goes over to the screen and suddenly decides it’s a foul.Seems they only go to the screen as an excuse to overturn decisions.The VAR room might as well,tell them to what to do immediately.

A Different George

I have not seen a single occasion this season or last when the referee went to the screen but stuck by his original call. I don’t know if it has happened in games I have not seen, but this is not a small sample size. Not once.

growly

a little?

Cranky Colin

It’s in old shityard.
Their critical fouls are ignored.
We know how it goes and we move on……

Dave Cee

What got me was Martinez and somebody ? made 2 huge fouls, and then Saliba makes a genuine effort at a tackle and immediately gets booked. That boiled my piss and told how the game would go. That said, it was naive to get caught on the counter twice like that. We could have managed the game better at 1-1

JuiceJ

Verane was all over Jesus, rugby tackles at times and finished the match without a card. Saliba 1 foul and yellow. United players crowd the referee mourning and its ok Jesus does it, its a card. Maguire takes out Eddie and VAR barely has a look. Who do we as fans complain to for the bias we suffer from these referees. I feels its too much now, a continuation from last season. Goals given while our keeper is fouled, literay held by an opponent, Saka gets held WWE style like Sheamus when about hit some guys chest and nothing given.… Read more »

Oscandwarf

I can only really speak about media bias as I remember it, although I’m sure there is some link between football media and the football establishment, in that they seem to very much like the same people. Anyway, as I recall, Wenger started it. He was unpopular with the media from the start in ’96, mostly because he didn’t disappear, humbly, tail between legs – because the English league was just so good, and tough, and manly and his weak frenchness just wouldn’t be able to handle it. Instead he improved the league standard and produced a team the media… Read more »

BigArse

If the directive to the on field ref is keep it flowing, then that should be the directive to the VAR. Mind boggling inconsistency.

Henkamp

It’s time to just accept that English officials are bent. They favour whom they want to favour. That’s the only way to explain why we are always having contentious decisions week in, week out.

If that was De Gea pinned back for the Villa goal in midweek, you can bet it would have been chalked off. And if that was a Spuds player Mings jacked up and tossed to the ground, it would have been given. It’s a fucking disgrace how refs can change the outcome of games in this league with gross incompetence and bias

Jeremy DG

Absolutely correct. It’s an uncomfortable truth for a lot of people and I totally get it. I don’t think anyone wants the game they love to be bent but we have to accept it is. I don’t know if it’s conscious bias, unconscious bias, or match fixing which correlates with betting patterns and all of the shady gambling firms across the world which have their grubby fingers in the premier league pie, but something is going on and has been for years. And it affects lots of teams, not just us. Until fans come together and make a stand, it… Read more »

AusGunner

This is fairly histrionic. It’s simply incompetence. As in other walks of life, when you combine incompetence with a complete lack of accountability, it can look like corruption. But some actual, non-circumstantial evidence of corruption rather than incompetence is required to make such an accusation seem non-petulant.

Gandalf’s Kebab

Why can’t it be both?

Badaab

Mike Reilly is crooked as a question mark and he hired all these guys

Beef

Yeah I think they call this principle ‘Hanlon’s Razor’ if you want to be supersmart about it.

But I can’t see how an industry that involves billions of quid sloshing around isn’t going to create exactly the incentives you’d need for corruption. People seem to think that this is just something that happens in Italy or whatever.

A Different George

There is no evidence of corruption. Of course the refs let the captain of England get away with endless fouls and constant diving. Does anyone honestly believe this is because Spurs pay them off? You’d think they would pay to win a trophy, in that case.

Vonnie

There’s also no evidence that there’s not corruption. PGMOL does what they like and seem answerable to nobody. Please explain to me all the checks and balances in place to ensure there’s no corruption……..clue…..there aren’t any.

Daveo

This isn’t bent… It’s broken.

A Different George

Simply nonsense. Arrogant and often incompetent referees, especially ridiculous and inconsistent in use of VAR–but absolutely no evidence whatever of being bent. There’s plenty of unconscious bias: a home-team bias, as in every team sport, and a “big team” and “big star” bias in calling fouls, and pretty clearly an English bias (“they don’t do things like that”). But all the Arsenal supporters who claim the officials are corrupt against us ought to ask supporters of other clubs. Go back to our last two FA Cup victories–did the decisions favour us or Chelsea?

That’s the wierd thing though – in the FA cup the officiating has been fair or (even slightly good towards us?) – and we won it many times last few years. I can’t stand the argument it evens out and stuff like that – decisions influences games especially big ones with even teams going toe for toe at it. Corruption is definately possible in the PL, but very hard to prove. But we can all agree it’s been biased against us in the PL and arguably cost us top4 last year (cedric on son, holding sent off, boot in tomi’s… Read more »

Alan Sunderland

I used to have the odd bet on a game, I haven’t for about 3 years. I just don’t believe the referees can be as inconsistent or incompetent as they are weekly without being either bent or favoring certain teams in games. I knew we were fucked before the spurs game with the narrative on sky pregame. Tierney gave a penalty and red card 1st chance he got. The decisions over the weekend were scandalous. The league badly needs to do something about it. I believe all the problems with var come from the arrogance of the referees, and it’s… Read more »

HenKamp

Fuck VAR

growly

i don’t like var enough to do that Henkamp!

Matt P

Fuck defensive lapses, poor finishing and endless excuses.

Qwaliteee

Poor finishing…?

How about Martinelli yesterday?

Sorry mate, but if that goal had stood we wouldn’t have lost yesterday.

If there’s anything that’s seemingly endless, it’s our own fans turning against our own team, even when the team has played well and only lost due to woefully poor and corrupt officiating.

Runcorn Gooner

Football is becoming more and more a non contact sport despite the supposed directive. Diving cheats reign. Refs have got to get a grip and not let VAR take over rather than help them.
It was a borderline foul today but so was the tackle in the box on Saka not even checked.
Total inconsistency is ruining matches.

Living stone

And Maguire’s grab on Nketiah.The double-standard is very annoying.VAR have to go, it’s more controversial than what we had before.

Dan K

But did you see that Van Dijk tackle on Onana? It was a straight up, Carry from Misery style potential leg snapper and I don’t think it was even flagged by VAR as worth looking at.

Hopefully this investigation sorts out whatever’s going on.

Zack

If you win the ball in your half with a bit of contact, for how long do you have to not score to be able to actually score?

T.A.

Well put. Very frustrating.

SGP_GNR

If it’s just bad refereeing, why did it go one way — mostly against us?
If I am being generous, I would say the officials were biased.
If I am being honest, I would say the officials were corrupt. And will continue to be.

Richard

Not sure if you are aware that the Premier League, before our game, asked the PGMOL, the refs association, for the first time ever, to an emergency meeting to discuss two decisions given on Saturday by VAR, one of them by the same guy running our VAR on Sunday…

Why isn’t that guy suspended until the outcome of that meeting occurred? Also the arrogance in him to do the same thing again!!!

Anthony

Problem is the PGMOL confuse Innocent and incompetent – defending your members against accusations of bias is one thing, but confusing it with clear incompetence is another.

VAR has made things far worse, by being absurdly selective in what is punished.

Odegaard challenge was a foul? 100% certain, exactly the same challenge in the box wouldn’t be a penalty.

Disgraceful how inconsistent things remain with video assistance, but sadly incompetence is actively allowed to rule.

Dave Cee

Do you remember the Calum chambers “foul” against crystal palace when we “scored” a last minute winner? It was disallowed, even though he was the player being fouled. VAR has been badly implemented. The world cup does it much better

A Different George

Yes, it was arguably a foul, but the referee saw it clearly from within ten yards. It was exactly the same sort of contact (maybe a bit less) than many other things he had not called until that point–and after that as well. It seems to me the purpose of VAR (the “clear and obvious” standard) is to go back when the referee is unsighted (he could not see the handball or the trip from that angle) or when he does not see it at all (a late tackle after the ball has gone and he is watching the play).… Read more »

AusGunner

Because it’s merely a requested informal meeting and not any kind of formal procedure. Why on Earth would they suspend him?

Brady’s bunch

Closed shop, it’s like the police investigating the police it doesn’t work.

allezkev

Lee Mason, a Manchester referee on VAR…

So when Man Utd visit the Emirates will the referee and VAR ref come from Islington?

Gooner7190

Don’t you know it’s illegal for Premier League officials to come from south of Birmingham?

growly

Nah… it’ll be Mike Dean

Bertieme

Odergaard is spot on.

PTAFC

As soon as I saw the replay I could see it was a foul, but i agree they got away with stuff, that Argie full back should have been booked in the first couple on minutes for his foul on Jesus. Arteta is a poor loser though and he panicked too soon with the substitutions. Blame the ref all you want but in the end our own undoing al la Wenger style

Henkamp

1. It was a soft foul. The ref clearly saw it and allowed play to continue (meaning it’s not supposed to be filed in the “clear and obvious error” stack which warrants VAR’s interference). That’s the contentious bit.

2. You are right about Arteta panicking. I said last week that his substitution prowess (partially in-game management) still needs a bit of sharpening… not many agreed. He is still learning and today would have been a big lesson for him.

growly

if Arteta wasn’t a poor loser I’d want him replaced, but today he wasn’t a poor loser. He was honestly robbed!

Brady’s bunch

The disallowed goal changed the direction of the game so it’s impossible to know what the outcome would have been.

ArsenesLongSufferingZipper

I wouldn’t want Arteta not to be a “poor loser”

Faxe

I watched MOTD this morning, ridiculous VAR decisions being the theme of the program. That’s when I knew there was no way we were going to play at Old Trafford and not get screwed over by VAR. When it happened, it was a case of ‘oh, at least it came early in the game’.

Collibosher

I was following the action on Arseblog, and I knew as soon as Martinelli’s goal was disallowed, that it wasn’t going to be our day.

Collibosher

As for the so-called victim of MØ’s “foul”, Christian Eriksen, if he had a shred of decency he’d still be playing for Brentford after what they did for him.

Gooner7190

Did I miss something with Eriksen? Voted MOTM but I don’t actually recall seeing him bar falling over for our ‘goal’ & playing a 2 yard pass for Ronald McDonald to tap in

A Different George

I think he played the pass that led to their other two goals. Was very good whenever he was not pressured. Very good player, though not in the same class as Odegaard who, I think, is on his way to being recognized as one of the best in the world.

Anthony

2:2 would have been the correct score.
Farcical to rule out Martinelli’s goal.
Similarly it is ridiculous that united third was allowed. Rashford was offside when the ball was played through, when he was brought into phase2 to score, it should have been deemed that his offside starting position had given him an unfair advantage.

Still VAR has had an atrocious weekend, but nothing will change – game is being further tainted by poor video officiating.

JackofAll

This starting position thing has been massively ignored and it drives me nuts

growly

the thing is goals shapes the game. you can’t just count decisions. you have to look at whatthey were and how impactful they were att he time.

With fair refereeing Mumu would never havev been in hte game after the first 20 minutes

AusGunner

I don’t think that’s how offside works

Gunner73

The technology of VAR isn’t the problem, it’s the people using it. They’ve got every single view and the time to analyse It and they still get it wrong. The only explanation I can see for these awful decisions is either incompetence or corruption.

Emi Rates

No surprise that VAR doesn’t work. Look who’s in charge of it.

StuArse

One of the issues I see relates to “playing advantage” in the penalty area. For example Saka wasn’t given a foul when he was taken out because he had a shot. Anywhere else on the pitch that’s blown up because the opponent tackled once the “pass” had gone. The challenge is the consequence of a foul in the box automatically means a penalty. Maybe football should look at hockey (field not ice) and have levels of penalty, e.g have a “short corner” or something. Otherwise refs will never give those decisions and I think it’s wrong

Martyn

For me, the ‘pox’, namely VAR, on football is a self-serving scandal. Just look at the so called decisions over the weekend. Martinelli’s goal was the last straw for me. I switched the TV off, something I’ve never done before during a Arsenal game. No goal can be celebrated anymore. The game has been sanitised to death. I can take defeats but not VAR anymore.

midgunner

Totally agree, VAR is killing the game.

The gains are so marginal they are not worth the impact on the natural flow of matches.

Matt P

Odegaard’s push was a foul all day long. I get so tired of the excuses and whingeing that comes out of the asses of many Arsenal fans.

UGooner

Some will say foul, some will say not, some will say soft. The ‘whingeing’ is because of the inconsistency. Would we get that call if the tables were turned? Highly doubt it! So if they could call the ref to have a look at that on the screen, how when Mings literally had Saka off the ground did VAR not ask the ref to at least look at it? Arsenal fans want Arsenal to win. Errr if they feel there’s injustice, it will come up. But most of us are positive, and we move on from here. Still all to… Read more »

A Different George

Matt has missed the point. Assume it was “a foul all day long.” The referee, who had a better view than you, did not agree. That happens in every match. In this match, the referee had not called a foul on a half-dozen similar contacts earlier in the match. If you think that his decision not to call a foul was a “clear and obvious error” then we are watching a different sport.

Graeb

Absolutely, the ref was about 3 yards from the incident and looking straight at it, VAR and cameras miles away. If Tierney (from Mancunia) had been given the full shot showing his position instead of close up by Lee Mason (from Mancunia) would he have realised this?
Look at Leicester first goal at weekend. Look at Villa corner against us. Look for consistency!

Jim Gooch

I was at Old Trafford yesterday but not in the away end (sssh!). Recent VAR incidents are clearly an issue but it was made worse for those inside the ground yesterday by the fact that there are still no big screens at this dump of a stadium and you have to rely on aged scoreboard type technology to tell you what is going on. At one point during the VAR check the screen I was looking at flashed up a “checking mistaken identity” message but they quickly changed it back to “checking goal”. It seemed like ages before the wrong… Read more »

Gunnar Eli Sigurjónsson

England
The only country where VAR doesn’t work

Everyone knew we would loose based on bs
We move
Next up European night

caldie

Thoughts and prayers to Eriksen. That he wasn’t injured after such a nasty foul by one of the smallest guys on the pitch is a miracle.

Qwaliteee

What hope is there for the rest of football when the game is run by corrupt biased cheats? This goes back well before VAR. In the ‘Battle of Old Trafford’ in the 1990/91 season, Brian McClair repeatedly kicked a grounded Nigel Winterburn whilst Paul Ince poleaxed Andres Limpar. Both United players, believe me, were lucky not have ended up in hospital – which is what would have happened to them if Michael Thomas, Paul Davis and David Rocastle had got hold of them. As it happened, nothing came from any Arsenal player other than some “so you want some afters,… Read more »

Qwaliteee

*Anders Limpar

Will cheShire

It was clearly and obviously not clear and obvious.

What is clear and obvious is the refs are either incapable of officiating at this level or they are biased against specific teams and players.

If a player is shite he is benched and maybe let go. If a team is shite, they get relegated. Why, if referees are shite are they not demoted or penalized in some way?

Qwaliteee

The refs and VAR are watching the game….

Who is watching VAR and the refs…..?

Who are those cunts answerable to?

Rajbinder Dhami

This referee was from Manchester he lives in Manchester who is he going to help Manchester we need neutral referees who ever picked this referee for this game must be United fan it’s crooks like this who fuck the game should be wiped

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