Monday, June 17, 2024

Vieira wades into Wenger debate

Patrick Vieira believes Arsene Wenger still has a clear vision for Arsenal’s future and will know when to step down as manager.

The former Gunners captain, now head coach at MLS franchise New York FC,  fuelled rumours of a rift with his mentor in January by revealing he’d not spoken to his compatriot in ‘a very long time’.

Despite also claiming that Jose Mourinho had more influence on his career, the Frenchman has waded into the debate over Wenger’s future by claiming that the banner, displayed by supporters after the win at Hull City, showed a lack of respect.

“I was surprised and I was a bit disappointed at the same time [by the banner],” the Frenchman told TalkSport.

“Fans can be frustrated, but fans sometimes forget what Arsene has brought to this football club and I think he deserves a bit more respect. Fans can boo and show their anger, but the way they did it with that banner showed too much lack of respect. But this is the way it is, this is football but it shouldn’t be like that.”

“Arsene will know when it is time for him to go. He knows what he is doing,” the World Cup winner added.

“He loves the game, he works really hard, he’s a work addict. He watches every single game, every single league and has a clear vision of what he wants to achieve. People like it or don’t like it.

“He has done a fantastic, unbelievable job for Arsenal Football Club and fans, with that message after the Hull game, went a little bit too far.”

Arsenal’s current run of two wins out of eight games is close to their worst under Wenger – the 14-game stint after Eduardo’s leg break in 2007 included only two wins in 14 games – and has him under severe pressure ahead of two tough away games with Barcelona and Everton.

David Beckham also came out in support of Wenger yesterday after he dismissed the banner in a comment via social media. “Disgraceful… No respect attention seekers” he wrote from his Instagram account.

Beckham has forged a friendship with Wenger in the years after he left Manchester United even being invited to train with the Arsenal first team.

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Norn Iron Gooner

You know things are bad when Beckham thinks he needs to defend you. Meh



Bench-Moore,Baresi,cannavaro,jairzinho,Baggio,Ronaldo(De Lima), Romario,Best,garrincha,Batistuta and so on.

Arsenal fc could go back and forth in time, assemble these guys and they’ll still bottle the league under Wenger.


Arsenal and Arsene has been disappointing but a lot of Arsenal fans behavior have been a lot more disappointing. Case and point ☝


All ye down-voting me will return here and moan when next the team does another screw job. I’m not even considering Tuesday,it’s already done.


r/gunners poll currently:

41% Wenger In
36% Wenger Out
23% Undecided
~1800 votes

Andy Mack

I’m surprised it’s as high as 36% With my mates it’s 2 out of 24 that want a new manager…


what a mess we’re all in. there’s too much pressure surrounding the club, and it’s either gonna push the players into a positive response or it’s going to end any hopes left of our season. watching Leicester and Spurs the past few weeks, it’s obvious they’re struggling but have been on the right side of results. they’ve not been capturing the form they had the first 8 weeks of the year and personally think both will be dropping a fair few points in the run in. until the season is done, I’m going to support and push the team as… Read more »

A Gorilla

The fans of this club really need to unite. For some obvious reasons, like trying to get the most out of our players and get as high as we possibly can in the table this year. But also, we need to remember we are a big reason why people come to play football for Arsenal, and if we’re all arguing, booing our team, screaming at our manager, then why would a top talent want to come and get involved with that atmosphere?

Crash Fistfight

Shit-loads of cash?

I think you give footballers too much credit.

A Gorilla

Unfortunately, there are at least 6 major clubs who are prepared to offer way more cash than us.
Take Aubameyang for instance, if he was even mildly interested in coming to the premier league, surely the thought of leaving an absolutel cauldron of support for a washing basket of nerves and groans is going to turn him off a little bit?
To be fair, all the top clubs in England share the same support problem, Stoke and Palace are probably the top two in terms of great support. Don’t know where I’m going with this anymore. I like beer

Crash Fistfight

Dortmund have far less money – he could probably double his wages here. I’m sure he’d be prepared to put up with a few boos in springtime when we inevitably fuck-up so that he can afford a new mansion or two.

Why is it that if we’re interested, all the other top clubs would be interested as well? I don’t see any of the other teams in the league having a need for him (maybe Man U).

Anyway, I’m getting caught up in the argument about one player – it could be someone else other than him.

Eternal Titi Berg Pat Nostalgia

Real is worse than us. Chelsea fans abused of Cesc, Hazard and Costa to my delight, oops. However Wenger is the most respectable manager in the League.


I”m quite happy that many footballers deserve far more credit than that, because that is a world of football I have no interest in. It’s why I don’t like Real, City, Chelsea (well, aside from the fact so many of them are utter cunts), and the other vanity projects.

Crash Fistfight

I respect your opinion, especially as you seem to be very sensible with regards all thing Arsenal. However, I respectfully disagree with the idea that footballers deserve any credit, as I also don’t think it is a slight on their character that they would choose to play for a team based on the pay available. I know having £2m instead of £1m isn’t life-changing in the same way as you or I getting paid double our salary, but it is a huge factor in where the majority of players play. If it wasn’t, everyone would play for their hometown club… Read more »


“anyone got a ST they no longer want?”

You mean a sanitary towel?


Nice call bud! I think people think 8 points is insurmountable, but Leicester could drop 9 points in their last 3 fixtures alone.

I had a lot less hope a few years ago when we were however many points behind the scum and were in a downward spiral. We all know what happened then.

John C

It’s currently 11 points


You expect Leicester to lose 3 games of their remaining 8 or so games, when they’ve gone almost 85% of the season with only 3 loses (2 of which to us, so factor us out of the occasion, they’ve only lost to 1 other team besides us) with an easier run in than ours? And then Spurs, who are above us (but with a tough run in) to also drop about the same number of points. Meanwhile, an Arsenal team that hasn’t looked convincing all season (especially since we lost Cazorla) and currently have something like 2-4 wins in 14… Read more »

Andy Mack

He didn’t say ‘expect’, he said the ‘could’ lose them. They’re running on confidence and they could finish the season without dropping another point. But they could lose at Palace and draw the next 3 games after against Sotton, Sunderland and West Ham… Could.


I belive more that Santa Claus is real, than in Arsenal winning the league. But I could absolutely see us losing the top four position if we continue our shit performances. Thats not pessisism but just looking at how bad we have playd this year and howe few points we have taken lately.


Problems run much deeper than just Wenger – but he’s the easiest, most visible target. I do think it’s disrespectful to lash out so abusively to the man. I love Wenger, he’s given me some of the best footballing memories of my life, but it does feel like he’s reached or nearing the end. The thing is, I’m not sure we have all the facts about what’s going on at a deeper level (in the boardroom). Nasri’s comments this weekend about it being Kroenke’s decision to sell him speaks volumes to me (the timing as well, as veiled support for… Read more »

Clock-End Mike

Re-unify the fans? Like the appointemnt of Moyes did for MUFC?

Ozil's brother

Well… A thin line between frustration and disrespect.

Stewart Robson's therapist

Becks is involved. This changes everything.


Ha! Enjoyed that one.
Thank you.


Footballers just don’t do irony do they, Vieira obviously forgets his flirtations with Madrid and Utd under Wenger’s nose and as for Beckham…attention seeking!!?


Good for Wenger that his friends support him. But not a good sign when former players feel they have to protect him.


Never liked David Beckham, until now.


Wenger needs to change with the times. He is too soft; all the time defending his players yet week in week out they let hi down. Hair driers and shoe throwing once in a while works. He should borrow a leaf from ferguson.


Wait you want him to modernise by acting like a manager from the 80s?


Being tough on his players doesnt mean that that tactic is an 80s tactic. Would you prefer he sends them a tweet or a personal email everytime they play badly? Spare the rod spoil the child makes sense with this Arsenal team. Thats what is happening to some of the Arsenal players. Spoilt. My opinion.


He needs to a/ deconstruct the pecking order in his mind that is related to some arbitrary weighting mechanism that doesn’t seem to count form. b/ order his team to take more risks and be not afraid to concede more possession because we don’t have to dominate the opponents just outside their box. C/ expect to lose the ball and don’t leave per mertesacker and Gabriel 2 on 2 with their attackers.d/ don’t put Walcott on as a sub against an inferior team if losing e/ tell players to not take red card risks early in the game, weigh up… Read more »


H/ tell the whole squad their confidence levels are rotten and they need to grow a pair and walk onto that field with pride and intent of showing all of these teams we should be beating that we are there to beat them.

I/ stop looking like his cat is up a tree when we’re down a goal. Sometimes I think this fragility is magnified by his body language.

Arctic Troll

Ferguson never did the hairdryer in public though, did he? He always defended his players or, when he couldn’t, decided to blame the referee/colour of the strip/weather/other.


I agree with what he says but I have long crossed him out of my legends list the minute he started talking about how mourinho has more on him than Wenger to care about his opinion.

Man Manny

I love Wenger and appreciate what he has done for the club; but that is the problem. When a man feels he has nothing to prove, stagnation and worse still, decline is the inevitable consequence.
Arsene must take a long hard and impassioned look at himself during the summer and take a decision: come to terms with the reality on ground and quit honourably or alter his approach drastically to make Arsenal a force again. No dilly dallying on transfers and mediocre players.
Viera is right, the board won’t sack him.

Bob Davis

Everyone has the right to express an opinion. Some fans have had enough.

The stadium move was for us to compete with the biggest. We get floored by teams like Swansea and Watford. It’s not good enough.

If we had bought a couple of decent outfield players last summer and we could have won the league this season.

Just look at Sp?rs and Leucester who are competing with a lot less than what we’ve got.

Wenger has nowhere to hide.


All fair points mate but same can be said for City, United and Chelsea? We’re getting crucified but City bought De Bruyne, Sterling etc and have done worse than us. Still because of recent silverware there’s no pressure on them.

Bumblebee Tuna

“Same can be said for City, United and Chelsea?” – where the managers have either been sacked, are being replaced or have faced similar calls to go you mean?


Which is fair play to them. They outspend us every season and can continue to do so cus we simply won’t or can’t.

It would be good to know how our club is run because if the board is happy to blame Arsene, and have imposed limitations on spending, then I don’t know if a new man could do better. It’s just not clear cut as it is at other clubs.


Wenger has already made it very clear that he decides player recruitment and no one else. This has been confirmed by Gazidis as well. Where on earth does this new narrative emerge from that somehow absolves Wenger of all responsibility and make him a Christ-like figure and taking on the sins of the board for the clubs sake? And what has any of that got to do with the same tactical mistakes that every iteration of the post-invincibles arsenal have been making? Or playing certain players regardless of the form of the player and others like Theo? Will we now… Read more »


Wenger has also made it very clear that he gets targets set by the board, and other than when he underspends what they give him, he does not set the full transfer available budget. They have never been honestly clear about what those budgets are, but hardly any clubs are despite whatever rumored numbers hit the media. Yes, it looks like he has underspent too often in some cases where we surely needed positional cover. No argument from me there. I’m not here to make excuses for anyone. Wenger has also been very clear that he sees it as part… Read more »


Spurs and Leicester have one thing that we don’t… The support of the fans.


They also have more points than we do.


Yeah. But I’m thinking the two might be linked.


If he had “bought”?
If he had “motivated” we could have beaten at least one of the four or five shit teams in the last run. Spurs, Hull, Manure, Swansea. Watford
It looks as if Mr Wenger is no longer able to motivate the team

el nino

I don’t want to see Wenger go out like this,,,,,
But Beckham can fuck off


Protesters have always used banners, placards, whatever to voice their discontent. I don’t have any problem with the banner as long as the wording on it is not vulgar etc. Fans have a right to protest if they’re unhappy.


I agree – they have the right! (and I’m also very disappointed)
But at the end of the day we also have to choose:

1. Booing the players and the coach with 9 games ahead of us.
2. Or support them as well as we can to take every little emerging opportunity we will have!

Eternal Titi Berg Pat Nostalgia

Agree,fans can express discontent without being classless. On the other hand, players should not wait for applause to perform. They get all kind of love from fans when they perform. They know very well what to do to win the fans back.


Vieira could hardly say anything else.

Have always loved him. Maybe it’s a girl thing. The Arsenal dinner ladies were in deepest mourning for years when he left.


I don’t think this is going to go away, we as fans have had enough of this mediocrity and the conversation I’m sure will be ongoing. You should be ashamed of yourself Mr.Gazidis, Mr. Kronke for not putting this clubs football results as our number one priority, you all seem more concerned about The results of each incoming financial quarter. I expect change this summer, something, or else.


I want wenger to leave now. I can’t see how he can continue because he’s lost too much of the fanbase. It’s sad. He’s an absolute legend and a gentleman and the fact that some of our fans see fit to treat him the way they do is a really poor reflection on them. A complete disgrace to our club.


so can somebody just tell us how protest respectfully with a banner?


Wear a dark suit.


Fuck this is depressing. No one is deluded and really expects a result vs Barca. They would have up seriously underestimate us like Bayern did a couple of years ago and I don’t think they will do that as bloody Messi just loves terrorizing Arsenal. We have 9 games left and need major help from others so League title also seems like a long shot. All we can do is try and get a max return of 27 pts and see where that leaves us in the end. Maybe Paddy will come and manage us after he’s won a couple… Read more »

Crash Fistfight

No offence to all those that love him for what he did in an Arsenal shirt, but Patrick Vieira:

a) sounds like a bit of a prick (and also acted like one, trying to get a move to Real Madrid for years)
b) doesn’t strike me as very knowledgeable about football (which seems to be the case with a lot of our ex players, unfortunately)


I know I might get my head bitten off by some of you here but we the club as a whole need to step back and start evaluating ourselves. I am going to start with we as fans. Let’s ask ourselves are we putting too much pressure on the manager and players? Are they panicking in front of goal coz they know the backlash they will get if they don’t win? Is the manager making risky substitutions i.e. substituting any player for Walcott right now is just the same as giving a player in our team a red card. Do… Read more »


Wait, it’s the fans fault now that Wenger keeps playing Theo?


We are stagnating and it’s down to the manager. Don’t get me wrong, I love the man for what he’s done for the club but we’re not moving forward at all. It’s always been tough trying to keep pace with financially doped clubs but when the smaller clubs are showing what good coaching, prep, motivation etc can do, all of the perceived excuses just evaporated.

Santa Cazorla

I’m done with paddy! Done!


Now we are out of the FA cup and going out of Champions League would hope that the players go into the last 9 games without pressure and go and win them all like we know they can do.


As much as we are all angry against Wenger right now, I don’t think the majority of us fans want to kick him out. I’m only basing my belief on some unscientific reddit poll where about 1/3 wants him to stay, 1/3 out and 1/3 undecided. It’s just that in recent times the Wenger out brigade have many valid reasons to be more vocal. Personally I think his biggest failure is to have never handled our injury woes in more than 10 years. It’s breaking our season every year.


Actually the online polls are showing about 80 percent in favour of Wenger leaving at the moment, though these sort of polls tend to swing wildly depending on the last match – a few wins on the trot and the 80 percent drops back to around 60; a few bad losses, as happened a couple of years back, and it rises to over 90. The people with the banners, however, are more considered Wenger-sceptics who’ve been wanting a change for years and don’t change their views with each passing game. However much you disapprove of banners at away games –… Read more »


Sadly, it is time for a new direction. AW has been great for the club but over-staying is like the once-good boxer getting embarassed in the ring. Summer clear-out – Gabriel, Chambers,Walcott, Giroud, Wlilshere, Ramsey and Ospina. Assmes quality replacements are available of course. Something needsto happen in the stadium – too ‘corporate’ and more like the ballet. I don’t go anymore as it simply isn’t enjoyable (not due to the football) , all passion is snuffed out by over-zealous stewarding.

Lula da Gilberto

I didn’t agree with the banner but I don’t think a politely worded banner expressing discontent is that rude. For me it comes down to this, it is an issue of freedom of speech. I can say something, and you can say what you like about it. But even if I say something abhorrent, I should not be stopped from saying it as freedom of speech is a constraint of authoritative bodies from abusing their position, and so my right to say it should be defended. The whole point of freedom of speech and the enlightenment movement if it is… Read more »

Arctic Troll

I sympathise, I do. I don’t think Wenger can take us beyond where we are, I don’t think he has it in him anymore, this season has proven it. It should have been a great way to end a career and we’ve blown it.

But I do wonder about the sort of person who goes to the trouble of paying £100s for a big banner, lugging it to every game, hoping we lose so they can wave it around and get their five minutes on the telly. It’s pathetic.

Lula da Gilberto

Yeah me too


It appears that they didn’t lug the banner around hoping for a loss.

They were disappointed with how things were going (3 losses on the trot, and really substandard performances). Not allowed to display it at the Emirates, so he took it to the next away game which happened to be a 4-0 win.

At least you can’t call him fickle, he pulled his banner out when we won 4-0 !!!


I dont agree with the banner but i also find it annoying when all these ‘football people’ come out and find anything to criticise but Wenger.

On motd they always criticise Arsenal for making the same mistakes, being lightweight, having no leaders, no #mentalstrength etc but then say that Arsenal supporters should be careful when some say they want Wenger gone.

And i like Beckham but i couldnt care less what he thinks about Arsenal fans and a banner, or whether he supports Wenger.

Lass Diarra

Spot on.


With all due respect Vieira and Beckham can shove their opinions where the sun doesn’t shine!

Neither of them have any idea what has been going on at the club, and it is a bit of an odd thing for Vieira to have said on the back of the spiteful comments he made about AWs influence on his career

As for Beckham, mind your own business you irritating simpleton!

Arctic Troll

I’m sure I’ll get a load of thumbs down for saying this. The people who drag that banner to every game, hoping against hope we lose and they get to unfurl it, are a big part of the problem. If the fans boo and hiss every single mistake is it really any wonder that the players end up looking like rabbits in the headlights? The way the season’s gone since that 4-0 at Southampton is disgraceful, I’m as angry as anyone, but yelling about how the manager’s shit and the players are shit and everything’s shit isn’t gonna help is… Read more »


They didnt drag it to every game, hoping we loose. They took it to one game, we won, they unfurled it anyway. It was to make a point at the failings of the team in this and recent seasons rather than just a reaction to one single match.


I don’t think Wenger has done too much wrong this season in terms of managing the team, aside from the lack of proper warm ups for substitutions. The biggest problem is the signings haven’t come in a timely manner. Why are we always playing catch up and not being pro-active in the transfer market? I’m not even talking about megastar signings. Elneny would have been way more integrated into the team if we had bought him during the summer. A few million, a few months earlier. Think that would have made a big difference. It may have put less pressure… Read more »


None of us has ever managed a premier league team. None of us has ever won the title. Mr Wenger has been there and done it. Football is not about if we win or lose,but how we play the game. We believe in ourselves.

Crash Fistfight

We’re playing the game appallingly badly at the moment as well.


everybody can yap yap but the fact remains nolonger has what it takes to challenge at the highest level. going out at the round of sixteen year in year out regardless the opponent, rallying to finish 4th for 12 years without a solution. times have changed and wenger can not cope


Democracy is aloud in football surely i thought the banner was true fans showing an opinion and others having theirs on it, i prefer the banner to the whistling and booing and abuse of Wenger our clubs philosophy is to be self sufficient and as much as we dont like it football is a buisiness, Victoria Concordia Crescit” Victory Grows Through Harmony.” lets get behind the team until the end of season “COME ON YOU REDS”


I keep saying it but I’m old enough to remember the pre-Wenger years and boy did we see some shit football, some good football too, but a lot of it was awful. It seems to me that most of the people screaming about Wenger are ones that have only ever known the great times he has brought to the club. At present we as a fan base are acting like a bunch of spoiled children. Christ, we have just won the FA Cup 2 years in a row and are still in with a shout of the league. We have… Read more »


And to that twat on Facebook that burned his shirt and had a rant. You make us a laughing stock you fucking muppet!


I believe Arsene Wenger has been a fantastic Manager for Arsenal but I think everybody should know when the time has come to an end and at the moment Wenger just cannot do anything right he has completely lost the plot he keeps saying we do not need a striker as we have Giroud but he has to realize that Giroud is just not good enough to win us the premiership he named about 4 really strong defensive midfielders in the January transfer window that he liked but then never bought any of them which we have suffered for all… Read more »


Amazing. There are a few very useful symbols on your keyboard, starting on the right from the key ‘m’. Look them up.

Crash Fistfight

I think the uproar over this season would be completely different if the teams above us were Man City and Chelsea, rather than Leicester and Spurs. In previous years, it’s been a case of us consoling ourselves with the fact that the deck is stacked in their favour, with all the money they are able to spend on players. Now, there’s no reason why we couldn’t have been topping the table, as the competition doesn’t have that advantage. Before the season started I didn’t think we were likely to win it (I thought Man City and Chelsea would swap positions… Read more »

John C

And herein lies the problem, this squad is built to finish 3rd or 4th with the built in excuse of not being able to compete with the financial doped Chelsea and Man City, but this season Wenger’s been caught out by those 2 being so shit. He knew full well this squad wasn’t going to get the 86+ points needed to win the league in a normal year but what he couldn’t foresee was it was only going to take about 80 and it was going to won by either Leicester or Spurs. He’s been rumbled and understandably us fan’s… Read more »


There was nothing wrong with protesting. It’s a right when you are dissatisfied. I wish fans can protest more because they have been taken for granted. There’s no denying that wenger has done a lot for Arsenal football club. But to say that he shouldn’t be criticised because of that is being down right myopic. He is taking the club in a wrong direction and fans are merely reminding him by protesting.


“Patrick Vieira believes Arsene Wenger still has a clear vision for Arsenal’s future and will know when to step down as manager.” Bollox. Arsene Wenger has no idea what to do now and will have to be dragged kicking and screaming out of the club. I ask the question again: does anybody want more of this next season? Only a madman now believes that Le Prof can win either the title or the Champions’ League. Why should this loser be given any more time at our club? If things go to form then we’ll now pick up a few wins… Read more »


Out of interest, when did you decide that Wenger was a ‘loser’?


About five years ago. And the last half-decade of bottling the title has done nothing but confirm my belief.

But, Hutch, I suspect that you’re one of those who think that throwing away an open-goal title somehow doesn’t matter; that Wenger is some complete genius because he had a great team a dozen years ago. But I’m not going to bother too much to convince you otherwise because are clearly one of those “True Believers” who view Le Prof as some kind of deity.

Carry on worshiping at the Temple of Arsene; I prefer to live in the real world.


So when the hard work of maintaining top four (whilst rebuilding the stadium and having to sell our best players), he then, by your timelines, subsequently turned into ‘a loser’.



In my opinion the real source of the problem is Kroenke and his unassailable majority on the board. He sets the priorities at Arsenal and until he is displaced or forced to modify his profit-first model, nothing will change. There’s no point calling for Wenger’s ouster if Kroenke remains – in fact it’s unlikely any manager will do as well as Wenger has in that framework.

Little Mozart

Every day that I go to work I am hounded by United and Liverpool fans about Arsenal’s position in the league table, as if they actually care about a club besides their own! Constantly, these people ask me to give a definitive statement on Arsenal having missed out this season but that simply wont happen because we are still, mathematically, if nothing else, in contention for two trophies before the season is out. That may change come Wednesday night, but I am very optimistic now because I see no reason not to be. My point is, members of the press,… Read more »


The attack on AW is purely emotional and reflexive, it more like Gary Neville punditry, but reality is far more complex to the understanding of the average Joe we are.

Fan never questions themselves, it is always somebody else’s fault.

I say rise above pettiness, and let’s all have some sense of reality.


uncle D

A lot of disrespectful fans here! Shame SHAME…O shame on you all…


Any time Wenger comes under scrutiny, 3 narratives always emerge;

1. It’s the players fault.
2. It’s the board’s fault.
3. It’s the fans fault.

Notice how al 3 tend to absolve Wenger of responsibility.

Yet if we went on to win the league, who will these same people give the praise and recognition to? Certainly won’t be to the board. Won’t be to the fans, even if we do cheer them on loudly till the end, and it won’t be the team in general, but maybe particular in-form players.

They will almost certainly give it to Wenger though.


1) Wenger is going to leave anyway sooner or later. Change will come anyway. But the wrong chap in and we may regress further too, there is always the risk. Considering the sort of transition period Klopp needs or say United are going through (with 4 place finish as aspiration) be aware of what you wish for. Do you want another empty handed season or worse. That is also a distinct possibility. 2) Shit load of cash doesn’t do shit. Man City. United. Chlesea. Contrast Leicester and Spurs. 3) As a MINIMUM finish consistent CL qualification and 4th or higher… Read more »


We weren’t a small club before Wenger. Who told you that?

Crash Fistfight

What are you talking about? We’d only won the league 10 times prior to Arsene arriving.

Maybe small in European terms, but if you’re looking at it that way, we’re smaller than Red Star Belgrade and Steaua Bucharest.



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